radio silence

Discussion about the Tacx collection of Video for Tacx Training Software

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Re: radio silence

Post by Tacx Video Production » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:30 pm

mcorn wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:07 pm
Tacx Video Production wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 6:04 pm
Mike Ive already said above that yes its something I could do but its also something I don't feel a need to do, its too small a difference to bother with the extra step, ride video quality is not an issue in TTS4. If you wanted a slightly sharper experience then just switch to TDA..it will even have 4K versions of many rides (I think we have about 100 in Beta).
You seem to forget that much of this discussion is driven by those who want new videos for TTS4 because they can't use TDA as a result of not having a Smart/Bluetooth trainer. Your first impulse was to say you couldn't do it, and then it was to imply it would be too hard to do (a "hack"). Better to just be direct and say it is too much work for too small of a market. That way, owners of legacy Tacx ANT+ hardware can plan accordingly and decide what they want to do. The tablet software is not really a good substitute.
Mike I said at the very start it can be done but needs a little hacking using an open source program, its just too much messing about for a small gain that really nobody would notice. If I had a way to be able to publish the rides to TTS4 from here then maybe it would be interesting but as it is I need to rely on Tacx & AIM to do the website & installers etc..I will be lucky to get 10 films out this year when I think I can probably push out 100+ rides in TDA.. really it takes about 20minutes to publish 20 rides..

You keep saying Tablet software is not a substitute but actually, I think it is for many users on older kit that like RLV. Tablets are really cheap & if we can stream the TDA collection your going to have an amazing looking image & access to all those rides. You do the ride & upload to the cloud & strava..hook a hdmi to it & run it with a TV. If a windows 10 PC & a new Smart trainer is not an option then the tablet App could be a really good alternative...but we need to see how all turns out.

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Re: radio silence

Post by mcorn » Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:38 am

Tacx Video Production wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:30 pm
its just too much messing about for a small gain that really nobody would notice.
These are mostly reasonable points and I can understand that TDA allows you to directly publish new videos and have a quick, efficient process for getting them online. Fair enough.

But this discussion has been blurring a couple of different issues together. I think the most important one is the availability of new titles for TTS4 to accommodate users who can't go to TDA and are not really interested in adding a tablet program if they already have a big investment in TTS4. And the second less important one is whether the higher quality H264 codec is of much value if your were to release additional TTS4 titles.

So maybe the "small gain" of being able to implement H264 in an avi container isn't really worth it, but there are TTS4 users who would like more titles without having to leave TTS4 for the tablet program. And you appear to be saying there are really not enough hours in the day to do many more TTS4 titles, which I think TTS4 users need to understand so they can decide about the future.

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Re: radio silence

Post by Tacx Video Production » Sat Apr 14, 2018 7:59 am

mcorn wrote:
Sat Apr 14, 2018 1:38 am
Tacx Video Production wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:30 pm
its just too much messing about for a small gain that really nobody would notice.
These are mostly reasonable points and I can understand that TDA allows you to directly publish new videos and have a quick, efficient process for getting them online. Fair enough.

But this discussion has been blurring a couple of different issues together. I think the most important one is the availability of new titles for TTS4 to accommodate users who can't go to TDA and are not really interested in adding a tablet program if they already have a big investment in TTS4. And the second less important one is whether the higher quality H264 codec is of much value if your were to release additional TTS4 titles.

So maybe the "small gain" of being able to implement H264 in an avi container isn't really worth it, but there are TTS4 users who would like more titles without having to leave TTS4 for the tablet program. And you appear to be saying there are really not enough hours in the day to do many more TTS4 titles, which I think TTS4 users need to understand so they can decide about the future.
Mike as you know it’s often been incredibly hard/slow to get finished beta tested rides for TTS4 through all the red tape at Tacx & Aim to be available in the webshop as a product. Nothing here has changed. I can now (almost) produce a ride from TDA now by simply exporting a file & rendering a avi..thats my work finished. Last week someone rode the Flanders Fan ride that I filmed a couple of weeks ago in TTS4 just to see if it worked. The problem is not here, the problem is the same one we have always had & thats getting the product into the shop..

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Re: radio silence

Post by wilf » Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:23 pm

Back to topic.

If you look at https://tacx.com/tacx-software-apps/

TTS4 is marked "Legacy software".

So why dont TACX give a discount on RLV at say "good by" to the loyal users of TTS?

The slow dying of TTS brings no more money. Only unsatisfied people. And what said markting: unsatisfied people tell it to 10 other, satisfied only 1.

Oh there is a little problem, there are some old hardware ANT+ only. I will wait, if they are sold for little price on ebay :D
Last edited by wilf on Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: radio silence

Post by mcorn » Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:51 pm

wilf wrote:
Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:23 pm

If you look at https://tacx.com/tacx-software-apps/

TTS4 is marked "Legacy software".
As I have said elsewhere, labeling a product as "Legacy" by a manufacturer is a death knell. You will notice that Tacx Cycling App (the tablet program) is also in that category.

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Re: radio silence

Post by wilf » Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:01 pm

mcorn wrote:
Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:51 pm
As I have said elsewhere, labeling a product as "Legacy" by a manufacturer is a death knell. You will notice that Tacx Cycling App (the tablet program) is also in that category.
I agree. So why a last big sale on RLV?

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Re: radio silence

Post by Tacx Video Production » Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:41 pm

One day they probably will but not until TDA gains some traction

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Re: radio silence

Post by wilf » Mon Apr 30, 2018 9:28 pm

Tacx Video Production wrote:
Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:41 pm
One day ...
Wahat sai my professor at the university: "In the long ran we are all dead." You can satisfy two different lanes, they must deside online or desktop.

They took the decision online but dont have the "cojones" to say it load and clear: "It's end". If Tacx tries to convert the TTS users to TDA - at the end they sell no RLV any more.

Sorry, I freeze my computers with TTS (3.13 and 4.22.7) - and I am out -> to say it loud and clear!

If I decide to take a online licence I will decide -> nice, good looking videos or competitive rides (sorry in this case no Tacx).

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Re: radio silence

Post by mcorn » Mon Apr 30, 2018 11:38 pm

I'm not sure I would classify TDA as online. It is still a desktop program so it requires a desktop PC to run. Like TTS4 and some third-party bike programs, it has certain online features, but it does not stream video, which would be more of a pure online program. But in order to run TDA, you are correct that an online connection and an online subscription verification is required each time you use TDA. There are pluses and minuses, but nothing is perfect. TTS4 kind of turned into bloatware and had its share of issues. Not sure how long TTS4 will function without updates, but Tacx released about 7 updates in 2017 and 2018. Last time I checked TTS3 still worked even though it has not been updated in a few years. In any event, one day Microsoft will release a disabling update to Windows and without some kind of fix from Tacx, TTS4 will cease to work. When that day will be is anyone's guess.

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Re: radio silence

Post by frankhertz » Wed May 02, 2018 1:38 pm

That's why I have a dedicated, refurbished, stand alone Windows 7 computer that I do not allow Microsoft to update. It runs TTS 4.21. I have enough videos to keep me going but will probably buy a few more of what's left on the Tacx website and then be done spending on the Tacx store. With these videos and Zwift, I'm good. Thanks Phil/Tacx for producing the videos you already have and good luck with the new platform.

Harry

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Re: radio silence

Post by mcorn » Wed May 02, 2018 5:07 pm

frankhertz wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 1:38 pm
That's why I have a dedicated, refurbished, stand alone Windows 7 computer that I do not allow Microsoft to update. It runs TTS 4.21. I have enough videos to keep me going but will probably buy a few more of what's left on the Tacx website and then be done spending on the Tacx store. With these videos and Zwift, I'm good. Thanks Phil/Tacx for producing the videos you already have and good luck with the new platform.

Harry
That is definitely one solution. Some have done the same thing with the older 32-bit Fortius software and using Windows XP as well. You do lose some capability by having no Internet connection and you have to be scrupulous about never having any chance of introducing a virus or other malware into the PC as you will be have no current anti-virus software working. You may also be very limited in making any hardware updates as well. And if you ever need to release and reauthorize a TTS4 license, you can't do that without an Internet connection. But again, that is a good way of preserving an investment.

So, are you using Zwift on this PC but not updating Windows 7? Doesn't that cause security issues?

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Re: radio silence

Post by Blueberry » Wed May 02, 2018 5:49 pm

frankhertz wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 1:38 pm
That's why I have a dedicated, refurbished, stand alone Windows 7 computer that I do not allow Microsoft to update. It runs TTS 4.21. I have enough videos to keep me going but will probably buy a few more of what's left on the Tacx website and then be done spending on the Tacx store. With these videos and Zwift, I'm good. Thanks Phil/Tacx for producing the videos you already have and good luck with the new platform.

Harry
same here with an older Win 7 computer ...

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Re: radio silence

Post by Tacx Video Production » Wed May 02, 2018 6:29 pm

Well I have the tools to convert TDA rides into TTS4 format, It did look like I was going to be able to get a bunch of new rides made for TTS4. Im sure we can come to some kind of solution at some point. Maybe a hard drive or something like a bulk download? I could fill it up with all the recent rides & ask them to just put one installer on the whole thing..that would avoid the webshop work as it would be just one product. Or they will make the effort to keep it going. Will see, the issue I have is key Tacx staff have moved on to different jobs. But if a good % of the userbase are going to stay with older trainers & software then as I have the tools & the films I do not see tacx being against making a little extra cash. So if there are rides in the shop that can keep you going until things have calmed down with TDA Im sure there will be a solution of some kind.

uploaded a little video clip to our FB page today from Liege https://www.facebook.com/ergovideo/vide ... 458637618/

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Re: radio silence

Post by frankhertz » Thu May 03, 2018 1:28 pm

To answer mcorn's question re security, probably there is some risk but I only have the computer on when I am "riding", virus check often and use CC Cleaner to "clean" the computer frequently. Also I try to remember to back up important info on an external hard drive. I am not sure what I will do if Zwift ever becomes too much for my meager computer.

Harry

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Re: radio silence

Post by mcorn » Thu May 03, 2018 5:13 pm

frankhertz wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 1:28 pm
To answer mcorn's question re security, probably there is some risk but I only have the computer on when I am "riding", virus check often and use CC Cleaner to "clean" the computer frequently. Also I try to remember to back up important info on an external hard drive. I am not sure what I will do if Zwift ever becomes too much for my meager computer.

Harry
I would classify this as a major security risk. A significant portion of the Windows 7 updates that you are blocking are security updates. Just being connected to the Internet or introducing any other programs or devices (like USB drives) puts that Windows 7 PC, including any personal or financial information, at risk. If you have a home network, it puts anything else connected to that home network at risk. 10 years ago, I did not get so worked about this stuff, but today I do. Many websites and IP sniffer programs are constantly looking for holes in PC's connected to the Internet. The only safe way to do what you are doing is to lock that Windows 7 PC down and never connect it to anything again.

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Re: radio silence

Post by Tacx Video Production » Thu May 03, 2018 6:33 pm

I think its safe to update W7 still & run TTS4, if there is an update then just wait a week or so & if there is not a flood of complaints in the TTS4 section of the forum then you are cool...There are 1000s of Tacx customers on W7 with TTS4 out there & most I bet are updating W7 when needed :wink:

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Re: radio silence

Post by frankhertz » Fri May 04, 2018 1:23 am

Ok. I understand the warning and took the advice offered. I updated windows and turned off automatic updating. Zwift worked fine today and TTS 4 opened properly. I'll check often for new updates and wait for their effects before installing them. Thanks.

Harry

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Re: radio silence

Post by frankhertz » Fri May 04, 2018 3:29 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... me-cortana

Maybe everyone should shut off automatic updating and follows Phil's advice.

Harry

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Re: radio silence

Post by mcorn » Fri May 04, 2018 4:08 pm

frankhertz wrote:
Fri May 04, 2018 3:29 pm
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/ ... me-cortana

Maybe everyone should shut off automatic updating and follows Phil's advice.

Harry
Actually, there is already a feature in Windows 10 that allows you to delay the installation of major feature updates until they are have been well used and deemed suitable for widespread use in an organization. This more conservative setting greatly increases the likelihood that a new major release will not cause problems. The way to change this setting is to:

1. Go to Windows Settings
2. Select Update & Security
3. Select Advanced options (at bottom of page)
4. Under "choose when updates are installed", select "Semi-Annual Channel". Do not select "Semi-Annual Channel (Targeted)"

Do not ask me how Microsoft came up with this bizarre terminology. A prior version of Windows 10 was even worse.

This is a good way to protect against problems associated with first release of major feature updates.

Shutting off updates generally is a bad idea as many of these are critical security updates. Unfortunately, we live in a world where there are many people whose sole occupation is to hack into your PC and private life and steal stuff from you.

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