Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Fortius, i-Magic , Cosmos, Flow , upgrade kits

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mcorn
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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by mcorn » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:14 pm

peter23UK wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:56 pm
Hi all,

Thanks to all those who have contributed to this really interesting project! I've just read through the thread - It makes a great read!

I have an I-Magic with a 1925 headunit, and wonder if anybody has had any success with this unit before I give it a go? It looks like most people have later models.

Thanks!
PeterH.
I believe you have the T1925 upgrade package which actually has the T1932 headunit (white with blue ring). The T1932 USB headunit works with both the older Fortius and Imagic brakes. If the Antifier works with the Fortius, it should work with the Imagic. But notice that I said "If". It is certainly worth a try, but my sense is you may find yourself doing a bunch of technical fiddling. I have not tried it myself.

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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by peter23UK » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:26 am

Thanks @mcorn and @ms6073.

Yes, its the T1925 upgrade pack, with the white headunit with the blue ring. I also have the original green headunit (pre-upgrade).

Thanks for your thoughts and advice. So it may not be a smooth ride getting this to run, but as you say - worth a try.

Regards,
PeterH.

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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by peter23UK » Fri Dec 28, 2018 3:28 pm

Hi mcorn.
I wanted to follow up on my last post.
First I wanted to add the link to the original thread where the antifier concept was initially 'born', which is here:
https://forums.zwift.com/t/support-for- ... rs/6632/27
This is full of lots of useful information, including a reference to the T1932 headunit.

I'm also pleased to say that the antifer works fine for me, using T1925 upgrade pack, which is the T1932 USB headunit (white headunit with the blue ring).
I have the 64 bit antifier version installed on windows 8.1, with both ant+ dongles in the same laptop.

The only points I'd mention are: -

a) I needed to grant full permission on the folder before the antifier would install.
b) I needed to delete the old Jungo driver, as just uninstalling wasn't enough - The trainer kept finding the old Jungo driver until they were removed.
c) I had to reboot a couple of times before Zwift was able to control the resistance of the trainer.

So now it all works fine, on one laptop.

Thanks again to all the contributors, great! :-)

Regards,
PeterH.

mcorn
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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by mcorn » Fri Dec 28, 2018 4:41 pm

I would say that is a quite an encouraging result. A couple of questions:

1. With this new driver setup, are you able to use your Imagic with TTS and any other programs you previously used it with?

2. Does this new driver interfere with any any other ANT+ devices you might have?

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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by peter23UK » Tue Jan 01, 2019 8:37 am

1. With the new driver setup, I am not able to continue using TTS, because I had to delete the Jungo driver, therefore TTS starts up, but cannot find the trainer. To go back to using TTS, I think I would need to reinstall the original Tacx driver install.
2. The new driver does not interfere with Ant+ devices I am using (Heart rate, Cadence and Speed sensors all from Garmin).

Regards,
PeterH.

bug2k18
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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by bug2k18 » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:44 pm

Finally got my ant+ controller working for my aging Tacx Flow. It tracks the gradients in Zwift adjusting the electromagnetic brake. I've created a new power profile which closely matches my power2max once calibrated. It gets picked up just like any other ant+ fe-c device with power meter attached. It's powered like the original controller from the trainer unit.

Image

Image

Image

mcorn
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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by mcorn » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:43 pm

bug2k18 wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:44 pm
Finally got my ant+ controller working for my aging Tacx Flow. It tracks the gradients in Zwift adjusting the electromagnetic brake. I've created a new power profile which closely matches my power2max once calibrated. It gets picked up just like any other ant+ fe-c device with power meter attached. It's powered like the original controller from the trainer unit.
Pretty nifty. Some questions and comments:

1. Have you posted a complete set of instructions anywhere? There are probably a ton of Imagic/Flow trainers out there.

2. I assume that this does not transmit ANT+ speed and cadence, but that could be handled with a separate ANT+ combo speed/cadence sensor.

3. I assume you would have to do some more to get an older Fortius to work. The Fortius has a much different power profile and probably some other characteristics.

4. Is this all compatible with either a 32-bit or 64-bit W10 OS?

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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by bug2k18 » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:45 am

mcorn wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:43 pm
bug2k18 wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:44 pm
Finally got my ant+ controller working for my aging Tacx Flow. It tracks the gradients in Zwift adjusting the electromagnetic brake. I've created a new power profile which closely matches my power2max once calibrated. It gets picked up just like any other ant+ fe-c device with power meter attached. It's powered like the original controller from the trainer unit.
Pretty nifty. Some questions and comments:

1. Have you posted a complete set of instructions anywhere? There are probably a ton of Imagic/Flow trainers out there.

2. I assume that this does not transmit ANT+ speed and cadence, but that could be handled with a separate ANT+ combo speed/cadence sensor.

3. I assume you would have to do some more to get an older Fortius to work. The Fortius has a much different power profile and probably some other characteristics.

4. Is this all compatible with either a 32-bit or 64-bit W10 OS?
I haven't posted instructions, I'm happy to help anyone that wants to make one up. It could easily be made to transmit speed and cadence, I have connected the cadence signal pin up to the arduino but haven't written any code to handle it as I already have ant+ speed/cadence units on my bikes. I couldn't say how compatible it is with the Fortius as my controller replaces the yellow/orange Tacx computer that came with the trainer, from looking at pictures a lot of trainers from that era they seem to have visually the same braking unit. The connection to the braking unit is an analog one, with resistance being set by syncing a pwm signal with a mains frequency ac signal from the braking unit, this either reinforces the magnetic resistance or counteracts it.

It would work with any device that has an ant+ receiver, I tried it initially working as just an ant+ power meter and it was picked up fine on my Garmin.

mcorn
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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by mcorn » Fri Jan 11, 2019 2:10 am

Your orange and white Flow controller was a standalone device and was quite a bit different than the PC interface that most users had. But I am assuming that the signal characteristics needed to control the brake would be the same. The brake's cadence is simply a feed through to an external sensor triggering the opening and closing of a reed switch, so that is very simple. On speed, I am guessing there is a hall sensor measuring rotations of the spindle with speed calculated using the circumference of the spindle.

The Fortius is a very different brake. It self-motors down hills and uses motoring to simulate momentum. Not sure how the software interfaces to that function. The power curve of the Fortius is very different than the Flow. In addition, the Fortius had both 110 volt and 220 volt models whose characteristics were fairly different.

Anyway, I really do compliment you for this nice effort. I currently use a Flow Smart, but have an older Flow brake which I might like to make ANT+ compatible. Personally, I would only care about brake control and not be concerned about speed and cadence as I use separate ANT+ sensors.

P.S. How does your system calibrate the brake?

bug2k18
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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by bug2k18 » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:22 am

I would be surprised if it worked with a Fortius with a motor brake, as I can see that needing a different kind of electrical connection to the computer.

This is the trainer I have:
Image

The imagic trainer looks to have a very similar braking mechanism:
Image

There appears to have also been a flow which is blue in colour, no idea what might be different on that version, the resistance unit looks the same.
Image

The calibration is a basic rundown test, with resistance set to 0, get speed over 30mph and time the rundown, this seems to work quite well unless extreme pressure is put on the tyre with the roller. The rundown time can change quite a bit until the tyre has warmed up.

Speed seems to be an optical sensor with a 4 slotted rotor that breaks the signal, there were a few quirks to getting a nice stable speed reading but works fine now, tracks the garmin speed reading well.

Having made this version there's probably quite a bit that could have been changed/improved with the interface circuit as I'm not really an electronics guy, but it works fine for my needs. I just started with a few things I already had paying around, the arduino and lcd. For someone with more time, the software could be improved, implementing more of the ant+ protocol, but for basic resistance control and setting of gradients in zwift, it works fine. I didn't see the need to send speed from this unit as virtual speed is calculated from power by whichever software is being used.

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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by Alex Masalovich » Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:40 pm

bug2k18 wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:44 pm
Finally got my ant+ controller working for my aging Tacx Flow.
Image
Bravo! Open your online store and start selling this device to all thirsty.
Тренируйтесь много, отдыхайте ещё больше!

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Re: Antifier- Program lets Zwift or TrainerRoad control older Tacx with ANT+

Post by hanswast » Wed Jan 16, 2019 10:32 am

Hello, I am new to this forum.

I currently have an old grand excel (a model before the fortius and others) which has a rj11 (telephony) interface which seems similiar to the interface of the tacx flow of bug2k18. I wanted to use swift, I read the information about antifier, and I a gave it a try and bought a T1925 headunit.

My current setup is a Tacx Grand Excel, the T1925 head unit, a windows 10 computer and 2 ANT+ sticks.

Antifier works, but I can get the powerprofile right. Anybody ideas how to fix this? Or does sombody have an updated power profile?

By the way, I am very interested in the solution of bug2k18 which seems more robust than my current setup.

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